Options for 4 speed

[Volksnut]

Don't remember if it has been discussed, but where is your e-brake? If not the rear wheels, it is on the tranny and the CL 435 will eliminate your e-brake, unless you upgrade the rear axle.

My e brake was on the trans (but missing, later A745 trans) so I located and purchased a '65 with axle e brake.

[PwrWgnDrvr]

Don't remember if it has been discussed, but where is your e-brake? If not the rear wheels, it is on the tranny and the CL 435 will eliminate your e-brake, unless you upgrade the rear axle.

My e brake was on the trans (but missing, later A745 trans) so I located and purchased a '65 with axle e brake.

[jboymechanic]

Has anyone tried adapting an A833 4 speed in a 2WD truck with the stock hydraulic bellhousing? I'd like to get my hands on a universal slant 6/V8 bellhousing so I can measure and experiment. In another project for a friend, I adapted a A833 4 speed behind a 1955 Dodge 241 Hemi V8 using all the original clutch mechanism and bellhousing. The bellhousing pilot hole (or bearing retainer opening) had to be enlarged to take the 5.125" retainer on the A833. I then made a 1/4" thick steel adapter plate to adapt the trans to the bellhousing. Moving the trans back 1/4" still allowed clutch disc alignment on the input shaft splines and the input shaft still reached the pilot bearing in the crank.

I thought I'd see if the same could be done with a Sweptline hydraulic setup, if someone hasn't already done it. Below is a link to the Forward Look forum with all the details of the swap, might be relevant here.

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forum ... ightmode=1

I would think that an ideal swap into a Sweptline would be the AX15 5 speed manual. The bellhousing is direct bolt up to a 318 poly or LA block and uses an 11" clutch/flywheel. The clutch fork is also actuated by an external slave cylinder.

[PwrWgnDrvr]

In case you don't know, the hydraulic bell is also the rear mount for the engine/tranny assy. The bell has 2 ears that sit on isolaters on the crossmember below it.

[Wildergarten]

In case you don't know, the hydraulic bell is also the rear mount for the engine/tranny assy. The bell has 2 ears that sit on isolaters on the crossmember below it.

'Almost unobtainable isolators' I might add. It took many months to get mine.

[jboymechanic]

Yes, the earlier Dodge trucks are the same. So if you can adapt the transmission to the original bell, do you have to fab a transmission cross member? Is there one in these trucks?

[PwrWgnDrvr]

Yes, the earlier Dodge trucks are the same. So if you can adapt the transmission to the original bell, do you have to fab a transmission cross member? Is there one in these trucks?

The hydro bell was used in 61-68. The crossmember is factory and integral.
69-71 is a mechanical bell, totally different, no crossmember under it and not possible to put one. The mount is under the tranny tailshaft.

[Txas2step]

My '67 D100 shorty was originally slant 6/3tree. Swapped out '66 318poly/np435. Same Hydro. bell for 6/318. I haul occasionally but mostly just use the truck for short trips around town. I like the floor shift np435 and rarely use 1st gear.Most of the time driving I go from 2nd gear to 4th. This would be an easy swap for you IMO. One other suggestion, find a 8.75 flanged rear axle with e brakes.( I think late '65-'71 D100 trucks , later models also).

[Wildergarten]

Swapped out '66 318poly/np435. Same Hydro. bell for 6/318.

Where'd you get the shifter boot?

[Txas2step]

Swapped out '66 318poly/np435. Same Hydro. bell for 6/318.

Where'd you get the shifter boot?

It's for a 2007-10 jeep wrangler. Bought it in January of this year and it was $36. Now $80. Pre-Covid.

https://www.ebay.com/i/132114380432

[Wildergarten]

Swapped out '66 318poly/np435. Same Hydro. bell for 6/318.

Where'd you get the shifter boot?

It's for a 2007-10 jeep wrangler. Bought it in January of this year and it was $36. Now $80. Pre-Covid.

https://www.ebay.com/i/132114380432

Thanks, I'm thinking of filling mine with stainless scrubbing pads with a welded wire "floor" to keep the mice and rats from taking up residence there. As long as the u-joints are tight and the rubber mounts are firm, I think it will work.

[jboymechanic]

Yes, the earlier Dodge trucks are the same. So if you can adapt the transmission to the original bell, do you have to fab a transmission cross member? Is there one in these trucks?

The hydro bell was used in 61-68. The crossmember is factory and integral.
69-71 is a mechanical bell, totally different, no crossmember under it and not possible to put one. The mount is under the tranny tailshaft.

Ok, so the hard part of an AX15 swap would be that you'd lose the bellhousing mounts and would have to do some fab work with the frame.

[jboymechanic]

I've thought about this some more and did some more reading, it appears the earlier Dodge trucks (like the Job Rated and Pilot House trucks from the 1950s and 1940s) used an NP420 4 speed transmission. This trans was the predecessor to the NP435 that is common in the Sweptline trucks with hydraulic clutches (there is probably some cross over in the early 1960s, some of the Sweptlines likely had the NP420 in the beginning). Anyway, these two transmissions are very similar and use the same bolt pattern. Therefore, the adapter plate I made for my friend's 1955 Job Rated truck to convert it to an A833 OD will also work on a Sweptline truck.

Should anyone want to try the conversion, I still have the CAD files and dxf file of the adapter plate from my conversion (link from forwardlook forum). You can get the file from the forwordlook link or send me a PM and I'll email you the files. I tried to attach the files to this post, but the website won't allow these types of files to be attached. This dxf file can be used by a metal fabricator or machine shop with a laser to cut out this adapter plate from 1/4 steel plate.

[712edf]

The NP420 was the main 4 speed in trucks until 1964 when the NP435 appeared. It is non synchro in 1st & 2nd. The flat fender power wagon guys can tell you anything you want to know about them.

Bucky

[jboymechanic]

I still have a spare adapter plate from when I did my friend's conversion years ago, I'd still love to get my hands on one of the universal slant 6 V8 bellhousings to double check this conversion would work. There are other details to work out, such as checking transmission input shaft length vs bellhousing depth and the original release bearing sleeve ID to the A833 bearing retainer OD. If anyone has one of these bellhousings they'd be willing to sell to me, please send me a PM.

[Wildergarten]

I still have a spare adapter plate from when I did my friend's conversion years ago, I'd still love to get my hands on one of the universal slant 6 V8 bellhousings to double check this conversion would work. There are other details to work out, such as checking transmission input shaft length vs bellhousing depth and the original release bearing sleeve ID to the A833 bearing retainer OD. If anyone has one of these bellhousings they'd be willing to sell to me, please send me a PM.

It looks like you have a good grip on this challenge. My recollection is that the A833 housing is fairly skinny. It may be that you can bypass the potential problem with the release bearing sleeve by making a turned sleeve adaptor to hold a hydraulically actuated throw-out bearing. There are a bunch of them available for all sorts of racing applications.

[jboymechanic]

You are correct, the A833 is tall/narrow while the NP420 and NP435 are wider and the adapter plate ends up looking kind of like a "+" with a big hole in it and you do have to machine a couple of bolt clearance pockets in the bellhousing (nothing that would weaken it significantly). In the Job Rated truck application, the original TO bearing sleeve was much larger than the A833 bearing retainer so I just pressed a copper sleeve bearing into the TO sleeve to get back to the correct fit between the two. Since the 4 speeds between the Job Rated and Sweptlines are essentially the same, I would imagine a sleeve bearing would once again do the trick for a Sweptline application but I'd really like to prove it.

[58pwrwgn]

The np435 would be the easiest.
If you are thinking about the 833 and mechanical bell. Why not just go to 5 speed out of a dodge and use it's hydraulic bell. OD would be a plus..
As for a 833 to the back of the 61-68 bell. There is a little more metal on the back face, than that 54 bell. You might just be able to drill the 833 pattern back there. The 833od size front bearing retainer is the same as the np435. The rest are 4.35 or 4.87. If the picture uploaded the input on the 833 is an inch shorter then the 435.
This summer I am going to try and put a np445, which has the 833 style input shaft behind my hydraulic bell. Replacing my granny np435. I think using the pilot bushing from the 90's that goes in the automatic crank register, will solve the shorter input. Then I have to decide if I should replace the disc and Bush my throw out bearing. Or replace the clutch, pp, bearing and modify my fork.

[58pwrwgn]

The picture posted. The left input is 68 and earlier close ratio transmission. The right is 69 and later granny first.