viewtopic.php?f=17&t=30971&p=229830#p229830
This is my original post from when I replaced my Cummins springs with D200 front springs.
This is a great post on the same style power steering I have in my truck.
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=20020#p140495
So this is what has been going on after I installed the D200 springs: Remember I have above mentioned PS and a 1992 Dana 60.
I love the ride, but after front end alignment and adding a 2.5" king pin steering arm block to level my drag link, to my push pull steering I still have dump steer. It's the worst on county highways and bridge lips, or when pulling trailers over 4000 lbs.
With the Cummins springs, they didn't move so the truck drove as straight as an arrow but beat me to death doing it. No really, it was Crappy!
I like the ride way to much, so fixing the steering is the way to go rather than firm up the ride.
I researched Cross over steering like others have used but my truck would need a lot more lift to clear drag link and the 8 quart Big block front sump oil pan. Or a rear sump oil pan, pick up and dip stick ($200) plus the cross over stuff ($300 plus).
So I stumbled on to Inverted T - style cross over. This is the fix for my application and thought I would share. The total cost is about $150. less than half of other style cross over steering systems.
While this isn't a 100% cross over it took me from a 14" drag link to a 30" to the other side. I got the idea from the WFO web site. http://www.wfoconcepts.com/pr/Inverted- ... /4295/4486 My cost at Napa was about $25 per end for three ends. $37 for (4) (2left and 2 right) Weld in ends from Black Birds Trucks in Spokane and $35 for DOM tubing at CDA metals.
Most parts are from Napa with the exception of the 1" Id DOM tubing and the Weld in Ends for the Tubing. I hate to say this but they are Chevy parts.
88' ish chevy 4x4 truck left tied rod end with hole for stabilizer bar, left and right hand drag link ends. I re used my right side tie rod end (on the left side) because it was in great shape.
So this chevy stuff is the same size 7/8 (18 tread) as Dodge used. So no need to drill or re taper holes because chevy and Dodge also used the same taper for several years.
You take the a left side tie rod end with the hole and ream/taper for a drag link end. I had to taper from the back side to keep my drag link as straight as possible. You install on the right side and use your right side end on the left. Measure and build your new tie rod adjusting sleeve. I re clocked my pitman arm 90 degrees. For the drag link, I used the long side on the pitman arm, seemed to fit better like that. again measure and build your new drag link.
I feel a very slight wiggle when the right side hits a big pot hole or intersection hump. other than that it is great. I'm also thinking about installing a rear sump oil pan and taking the bend out of the drag link.
I think the only thing my truck needs now is a front sway bar.
Excuse all the grease the cordless grease gun gets away from me.... lol The old tie rod ends were just for mock up purposes only. I picked them up with adjusting sleeve from Pull N Save only for mock up. Parts from Pull N save was the best $20 I've spent in a long time.
Inverted T /cross over steering
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jimmy
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Inverted T /cross over steering
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Last edited by jimmy on Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Inverted T /cross over steering
It doesn't appear your solving the problem of the steering box twisting the frame in and out when you turn. That's why Ford runs an extra parallel drag link to the axle so it counter balance all the forces from the steering box.
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jimmy
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Re: Inverted T /cross over steering
How you been Mike- I think your correct. I think the problem is showing up more than usuall because of the front shackles. I think they are adding to the twist or walk.
The problem I have with a track bars is I will have to replace my oil pan/pick up and dip stick with a rear sump set up to make room, but may have to change it.
But I did read your notes on the track bar in a nother post.
Did any manufactures use track bars on leaf spring trucks?
thanks again.
The problem I have with a track bars is I will have to replace my oil pan/pick up and dip stick with a rear sump set up to make room, but may have to change it.
But I did read your notes on the track bar in a nother post.
Did any manufactures use track bars on leaf spring trucks?
thanks again.
Re: Inverted T /cross over steering
Jimmy, yes this pictures I posted are from a '99 F350 4x4
download/file.php?id=23006&mode=view
The parallel link is high lighted and that's the 2 leaf springs right in front of the pic. Just crawl under any Ford Superduty and see how they did it. That's all I did was copy how Ford did there trucks.
download/file.php?id=23006&mode=view
The parallel link is high lighted and that's the 2 leaf springs right in front of the pic. Just crawl under any Ford Superduty and see how they did it. That's all I did was copy how Ford did there trucks.
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jimmy
- Sweptline.ORG Pioneer
- Posts: 1317
- Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 9:53 am
- City: Spokane
- State: WA
- Location: Spokane Wa
Re: Inverted T /cross over steering
oh I should have looked at the picture again. I had my wife turn the wheel back left and right, to my supprise I don't have nearly as much side to side twist as I thought I would.
it's really pretty low, but I wouldn't know what everything is doing while driving and springs are moving and what not.
This looks like my next project. Things I will need for starters are rear sump pan, pick up, and dip stick and motivation!
it's really pretty low, but I wouldn't know what everything is doing while driving and springs are moving and what not.
This looks like my next project. Things I will need for starters are rear sump pan, pick up, and dip stick and motivation!
-
jimmy
- Sweptline.ORG Pioneer
- Posts: 1317
- Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 9:53 am
- City: Spokane
- State: WA
- Location: Spokane Wa
Re: Inverted T /cross over steering
Update: I installed my skinny winter wheels and tires and the slight bump steer got better. Less leverage on the suspension and steering parts I guess, this made me start wandering if the track bar idea was going to solve all my problem. I have been wandering about the condition of my king pins.
Looking back; When I installed the dana 60 back when I built the truck I only repacked wheel bearings and rebuilt brakes as they needed. The axle had about 230,000 on it as I recall when I snagged it from the doner truck. It was a loggers truck that I'm sure was getting beaten.
About one year ago I replace the upper plastic cup, the old one were worn almost in two. I could see the tires tipping inward at the top. Anyway, I've wandered for quite some time about the condition of king pins, bearings, cups, and springs. I've read online articles and asked several front end specialty shops how to inspect them. I get different answers which really bothers me. But the most trusted people say with this style king pin unless you hear something or you already have broken parts everything must be fine. Or to take everything apart and inspect. Well- no way I was going to take everything apart and re-install parts that now have 250K. That's crazy, and at a minimum I would need two lower grease seals, other wise it's impossible to inspect the lower bearing and race. So I ordered the complete kits from Amazon - Yukon Packaged for $85.00 per side and free shipping. Everything you could think of upper and lower everything was in the package. I removed all old parts and inspected while removing. Installed all new king pin parts plus the inner axle tube seals both sides (my left side was dripping). Truck drives much better which sounds crazy because the truck has always driven pretty good. I've been noticing when I backed up and stop the tires always looks funny, like they were out of alignment. I could also feel like dragging... very slightly. Once I stopped after backing up the tires looked like they were wider at the rear, much more than normal toe. Seems normal now. I didn't see any horrible wear in the old parts. The lower bearings seamed loose in the cage and the upper springs were collapsed about 1/8 inch compared to the new springs.
I'm glad I did the rebuild, now I will never have to work on it again.
I'm still thinking about a track bar because I think its the right thing to do. before I start a track bar project I will have to find a rear sump pan, dip stick and pick up. Anyone have one?
Looking back; When I installed the dana 60 back when I built the truck I only repacked wheel bearings and rebuilt brakes as they needed. The axle had about 230,000 on it as I recall when I snagged it from the doner truck. It was a loggers truck that I'm sure was getting beaten.
About one year ago I replace the upper plastic cup, the old one were worn almost in two. I could see the tires tipping inward at the top. Anyway, I've wandered for quite some time about the condition of king pins, bearings, cups, and springs. I've read online articles and asked several front end specialty shops how to inspect them. I get different answers which really bothers me. But the most trusted people say with this style king pin unless you hear something or you already have broken parts everything must be fine. Or to take everything apart and inspect. Well- no way I was going to take everything apart and re-install parts that now have 250K. That's crazy, and at a minimum I would need two lower grease seals, other wise it's impossible to inspect the lower bearing and race. So I ordered the complete kits from Amazon - Yukon Packaged for $85.00 per side and free shipping. Everything you could think of upper and lower everything was in the package. I removed all old parts and inspected while removing. Installed all new king pin parts plus the inner axle tube seals both sides (my left side was dripping). Truck drives much better which sounds crazy because the truck has always driven pretty good. I've been noticing when I backed up and stop the tires always looks funny, like they were out of alignment. I could also feel like dragging... very slightly. Once I stopped after backing up the tires looked like they were wider at the rear, much more than normal toe. Seems normal now. I didn't see any horrible wear in the old parts. The lower bearings seamed loose in the cage and the upper springs were collapsed about 1/8 inch compared to the new springs.
I'm glad I did the rebuild, now I will never have to work on it again.
I'm still thinking about a track bar because I think its the right thing to do. before I start a track bar project I will have to find a rear sump pan, dip stick and pick up. Anyone have one?